Mailing lists

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This page is about the ProgClub mailing lists. The lists are available to the general public, you don't have to be a member to subscribe to any of them (except for the admin list, which is private). If you are a member, then you have to be subscribed to the announcement list, and that's all. The other lists are just there in case you'd like to be more involved with the club.

If you're going to be subscribing to any of the ProgClub mailing lists, you probably want to setup mail filters so that list traffic goes to a folder that is out of the way of your Inbox. See mail filters for an explanation about how to do this. Assuming you don't already know how to configure mail filters, though you probably do. I mean, you are a programmer, aren't you?

Contents

Terms and conditions

Please ensure you are familiar with the ProgClub terms and conditions as they apply to the mailing lists which are a ProgClub forum. Particularly see the copyright policy. Usage of the mailing lists indicates acceptance of the terms and conditions.

Lists

There are five mailing lists as detailed below.

ProgClub announcement

List announcement@progclub.org
Subject prefix [ProgClub announcement]
Topic Important ProgClub news
Moderation Posts to this list need to be approved by an administrator
Subscription Anyone can join
Reply-To list@progclub.org
Archives announcement archives
Sign-up announcement management
Administration announcement administration

Messages to this list have a subject that begins with [ProgClub announcement].

This is a public list, its contents are published on the internet.

This list is a moderated low-frequency low-noise list for notifying members (and other interested parties) of important ProgClub news.

ProgClub list

List list@progclub.org
Subject prefix [ProgClub list]
Topic General discussion
Moderation Anyone can post
Subscription Anyone can join
Reply-To list@progclub.org
Archives list archives
Sign-up list management
Administration list administration

Messages to this list have a subject that begins with [ProgClub list].

This is a public list, its contents are published on the internet.

This is the general purpose mailing list that all members are optionally subscribed to upon registration.

The rules for this mailing list are that you can talk about anything at any time. There is no 'topic'. The only posts that you are not allowed to send to this list are complaints about the topic. People who complain about the topic on this list will be flamed to high heaven.

If you have a burning political agenda and simply need to tell everyone you possibly can about what's bothering you, then list@progclub.org would be an entirely acceptable place to send your rant. We'll judge you on what you say, not on how we perceive its relevance to our idea of what the mailing list should be about.

Sometimes you don't want a list with a specific focus or 'topic'. Sometimes you just want a place where you can hangout, be yourself, and have a chat. That's what list@progclub.org is for.

ProgClub programming

List programming@progclub.org
Subject prefix [ProgClub programming]
Topic Computer programming and systems administration
Moderation Anyone can post
Subscription Anyone can join
Reply-To programming@progclub.org
Archives programming archives
Sign-up programming management
Administration programming administration

Messages to this list have a subject that begins with [ProgClub programming].

This is a public list, its contents are published on the internet.

This is a programming and systems administration specific mailing list that all members are optionally subscribed to upon registration.

We understand that there are a class of people who can't tolerate deviations from a particular 'topic' on the internet. They have been sending completely off-topic emails to mailing lists around the world complaining about the 'topic' since the internet was invented, and we're pretty sure they're not going to go away. So programming@progclub.org is for them.

You should only send material related to programming or systems administration to this list, other topics are unacceptable. This includes, by the way, complaints about the 'topic'. If someone makes a mistake and sends off-topic material to programming@progclub.org then you should reply to them directly informing them of their indiscretion -- the rest of the list really doesn't need to know about it.

If you have something that you think is interesting to say in response to a message on this list, but you know that what you have to say is not strictly related to programming or systems administration, then you should reply to the message and re-address it to list@progclub.org. That way, you get to have your say, and you don't upset the topic nazis.

We don't anticipate ever being large enough to justify sub-topic areas for particular programming languages or platforms, so you can send your message here if its related to any programming language or platform.

ProgClub vcs

List vcs@progclub.org
Subject prefix [ProgClub vcs]
Topic Version control system reports
Moderation Anyone can post
Subscription Anyone can join
Reply-To list@progclub.org
Archives vcs archives
Sign-up vcs management
Administration vcs administration

Messages to this list have a subject that begins with [ProgClub vcs].

This is a public list, its contents are published on the internet.

This is a high-noise high-frequency list that broadcasts notification about all checkins to ProgClub's pcrepo subversion repository. If we end up having more version control systems then they can use this list too. Replies to messages from this list should be sent back to either list@progclub.org or programming@progclub.org because it's probable that no-one pays a lot of attention to this list because it's so noisy. If you want to know what programming activities ProgClub members are up to then this is the list for you!

ProgClub admin

List admin@progclub.org
Subject prefix [ProgClub admin]
Topic Systems administration news and requests
Moderation Anyone can post
Subscription ProgClub administrators only
Reply-To admin@progclub.org
Archives No public archives
List info admin list info
Administration admin administration

Messages to this list have a subject that begins with [ProgClub admin].

This is a private list, its contents are only published to ProgClub administrators.

This is the mailing list that all ProgClub administrators are subscribed to. It is not available to the general public, nor to non-administrator members.

Send messages to this list if you are having a problem with your account that you need an administrator to address. Don't send anything else to this list.

As with the programming@progclub.org list, if you have something to say that is not relevant to ProgClub systems administration, then send your reply to list@progclub.org instead. Be aware however that sensitive information might have been sent to this private list, so if you're replying to another list make sure you remove anything that might be considered sensitive, such as the identity of the person you are responding to (if they're not a known member of the other list) or the like.

Choosing a list to send your message to

So there are five lists, where do you send your message? Firstly, don't send it to more than one list, that would be annoying.

If your message is about something related to the configuration of the ProgClub network that you need fixed, then send your message to admin@progclub.org.

If you're pretty sure your message is specifically related to programming or systems administration, then send your message to programming@progclub.org.

If your message contains important club news that should be sent to all ProgClub members, then send your message to announcement@progclub.org. Be aware that messages to the announcement list are moderated so your message will need to be approved before it is broadcast.

In any other event, or even if you just feel like it, send your message to list@progclub.org.

You probably don't want to send email to vcs@progclub.org because it's likely no-one will see it. Better to post to programming@progclub.org in that case.

Bear in mind that messages to programming@progclub.org might enjoy a broader audience than messages to list@progclub.org as some people will not subscribe to the latter's inanity.

If you have an administrative message concerning service outages, ProgClub news, or anything else to be broadcast to members, send your message to announcement@progclub.org.

If you're sending to either list@progclub.org or programming@progclub.org and you need to ensure that ProgClub administrators also get the message it is OK to CC admin@progclub.org too. In that case some people will get the message twice, but that's OK.

Replying to messages

For announcement@progclub.org, you should send your replies to list@progclub.org.

For list@progclub.org, you should send your reply to the list. If it's a complaint about the topic, then you shouldn't be sending it. If it's a private comment, send it to the OP. Don't reply to the list and the OP, they'll get the message twice, and that will be annoying. If you know that the OP is not on the list, then it's appropriate to CC them in your reply, or address To them and CC the list, either is fine. The Reply-To header for list@progclub.org is set to the list.

For programming@progclub.org, you should send replies that are directly related to the thread back to the list with the subject line unmodified. If your reply is related to programming and systems administration, but your reply is not strictly relevant to the message you are replying to, then you should change the subject line to reflect your new subject when you reply. If you forget to change the subject line, that's OK, we forgive you. If your reply is a complaint about the topic, address your reply to the OP. If your reply is not related to programming or systems administration, address your reply to list@progclub.org. If you know that the OP is not on the list, then it's appropriate to CC them in your reply, or address To them and CC the list, either is fine. The Reply-To header for programming@progclub.org is set to the list.

For vcs@progclub.org, you should send your replies to programming@progclub.org. Otherwise they'll probably get lost in the noise.

For admin@progclub.org, you should send replies 'To All'. That means that you should send your reply back to the admin@progclub.org list, and back to the OP. This is because the OP is probably not on the admin list. If you know that the OP is on the admin list, then you might like to reply directly to the list, but for this list it's OK if you don't. The Reply-To header for admin@progclub.org is set to the list.

Complaining about the mailing list policy

People feel strongly about mailing list issue like this, so the rules are being dictated. With benevolence, naturally. If you have a complaint about the rules, you're probably in the wrong place; but you can send your complaint to list@progclub.org, and we can gauge people's opinion and pretend like we're a democracy for a little while. Like Australia.

Complaining about the topic

Don't. Really. But... if you feel you simply must complain about a perceived policy deviation, send your complaint addressed directly to the offender, and don't bother anyone else with your pettiness. Feel free to link them to this page, where the rules are made quite clear. Oh, and if the offender is John, then really you shouldn't send your complaint at all -- he really doesn't want to hear about it. Thanks.

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